24 January 2010

S Eugene

While investigating on my computer the Parisian church of S Eugene, I was intrigued to find that, in the schedule of Masses according to the 1962 Calendar, they list Sunday January 10 as "Epiphanie". I would have expected the Holy Family. I'm sure there is an interesting explanation?

It is splendid that even recalcitrant members of the French episcopate are seeing to it that they are on the right side of the motu proprio. Good for Pope Benedict! And I can certainly see how important it is that when the Review takes place, bishops can't say "Well, we made provision, but after the first few weeks practically nobody turned up". So best wishes to churches like S Eugene.

In the great papal city itself ... Avignon, that is ... where the SSPX congregation welcomed this poor Anglican with great warmth, I gather that the Bishop, whom they described to me as very antipathetic towards the Old Rite, has now made provision for it ... with Masses and liturgical events happening at precisely the same times as in the SSPX church.

I'm not quite sure what to make of this.

Incidentally, it is the Sovereign Pontiff's wish that prayer for Unity should not forget the dialogue with SSPX ... and the Ordinariate Enterprise. Surely this is not simply because Unity is so dear to his heart, but also because we both have the capacity to advance his project for the resacralisation of the Latin Church. I have no idea what goes on at meetings of Deanery Clergy in the RC Church - nor even, in fact, whether Deanery Clergy do meet. But, assuming they do, I wonder what sort of difference it would make to the Atmosphere and to the Group Dynamics to have a couple of Anglicans and a couple of Lefebvreists as part of the mix! Festinet dies.

17 comments:

Fr LR said...

I know of a Roman priest that jokingly refers to his deanery meetings as "slumber parties" (it really tics off his bishop too)! I can't speak for the SSPX, but TAC Ordinariat clergy would be well advised to pack a hickory stick on their first such venture - and be willing to use it in their bodies defense.

Joshua said...

I don't know what to make of the above comment (sounds a bit sus'); from what I understand, deanery meetings are the sort of boring committee sessions that substitute for taking the discipline as penance.

I expect that Epiphany on the 10th means "the external solemnity of the Epiphany will be observed on the first Sunday after the actual day, with Mass thereof".

Joshua said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Joshua said...

Entirely off topic - what would be the Latin for "troll", of the internet kind? I need this for a deprecatory blessing...

ADALBERT said...

S.Eugene has been knowing the first motu proprio since 1988, just as two other parishes in the archdiocese of Paris.

Though Cardinal Vingt-Trois is not a fervent supporter of the new motu proprio, the situation is not that difficult in his diocese. thanks to his predecessor Cardinal Lustiger the clergy is still numerous, orthodox, young, and conservative. For traditionnalists it is easy to find support in this church.

So the second did not change its life.

Chris said...

I'd just use "trollus" (e.g. Nolite trollos pascite) as the Romans didn't get up into Scandinavia to encounter them.

GOR said...

If I recall correctly Father, this was broached by Fr. Finigan (“Hermeneutic of Continuity”) some time ago and he said he would be most willing to have Ordinariate and SPPX priests participate in his deanery meetings. I don’t know what transpires in deanery meetings these days. Years ago, in addition to dealing with diocesan ‘housekeeping’ issues, there would be a ‘Topic’ – some issue of Moral or Dogmatic Theology pertinent to the time - which one of the participants would have been deputed to present. Following his presentation, all participants would discuss it.

I don’t know if that still obtains or if there are diocesan guidelines for these meetings. I expect much depends on the Dean himself, not to mention the Ordinary! Like corporate meetings in the business world I suspect some are useful and many are not. But a broader participation might impart a breath of fresh air to them, enliven the discussions and benefit everyone.

Figulus said...

Joshua, for what it's worth, the great churchman and ethnologist Olaus Magnus referred to trolls as "metallici daemones" in his monumental Historia de Gentibus Septentrionalibus. This is the earliest mention of trolls in Latin that I know of, but I have yet to read Saxo Grammaticus ...

Joshua said...

Apologies to Fr H for using his blog so shamelessly...

Many thanks for the suggestions about how to render "troll" (my blog's been suffering such recently) - I'd wondered if it could be treated as 3rd declension (since in the nominative such nouns can end in consonants) - and I really like "metallici dæmones" (am I right in reading the first word as referring by metonomy to the mines, as in that music of Grieg "in the hall of the mountain king"?) since it sounds somehow suitable to the modern use of the word, referring to those who lurk amidst the copper wires...

I must admit, when I think of trolls, I think of that fairytale I learnt at mother's knee about the troll lurking under the bridge and eating all the little kids - what would be the nearest mythological creature in the Græco-Roman imaginarium?

The Raven said...

Joshua

The closest things to trolls that I can think of are the καλλικανζεραι (apologies for almost certain mis-spelling and lack of diacreses), that still haunt the Greek imagination (in living memory Cypriots would throw cakes and sweets onto the roofs of their houses to placate the καλλικανζεραι).

Patrick Leigh-Fermour theorised that the καλλικανζεραι were perhaps folk memories of the stories of the centaur (he theorised that their mane was derived from "the good centaurs, καλλοι κενταυροι). Looking at the metopes from the Pathenon, I can believe that the centaurs served a similar purpose in the ancient Greek mind as the trolls did for the Scandinavians.

Joshua said...

How very interesting! I must delve into all this...

Fr William said...

Fascinating! A quick bit of Googling (and what a blessing Google is to those of us whose façade of learning far outstrips our actual knowledge!) reveals, in various spellings, the Καλλικάτζαρος / Καλικάντζαρος / Καλικάτζαρος / Καλλικάντζαρος. There is an article on it in Wikipedia (another wonderful aid to pretended learning, as long as one handles it with caution), which tentatively supports the Leigh Fermour etymology.

Figulus said...

Joshua, yes, "metallici daemones" means mine demons; the Latin word metallus means rather more than its English cognate, as Georgius Agricola's "De Re Metallica" demonstrated.

The Raven's mention of Greek trolls reminds me of other (older?) Latin names for the mine demon, namely "Coballus" and its diminutive "Coballinus", which you might recognize in their English cognates Kobold and Goblin, as well as, oddly enough, cobalt (Latin "cobaltum").

I rather approve of the potential neologism "coballinare". At least, I like it more than "metallice daemonare".

Now I'm really rambling.

Michael said...

".. with Masses and liturgical events happening at precisely the same times as in the SSPX church."
This was ever the case. Whenever the SSPX opened a church, the COnciliar church would begin Indult Masses in a church as close to the SSPX church as possible, and for services to conflict, by being arranged at the same time. So, nothing new in Avignon. The Conciliar Church hates the True Church. The SSPX is their stumbling block. Nice to know that the SSPX welcomed you. I can't understand why you don't join us, or why you haven't joined us ages ago.

Joshua said...

Ah, Figulus, very useful! What a useful verb...

Joshua said...

Pursuant to the above remarks, I've delved into these matters a little more, and found:

- mediæval Latin rendered goblin as gobelinus;

- coballus derives from the Greek κόβαλος, meaning a knave or impudent rogue;

- the new Latin verb suggested, coballinare, to troll, directly parallels the Greek verb κοβαλικεύω, "to play the knave".

Figulus said...

Since there is a danger that some attention may be paid to my ramblings above, it behooves me to correct some spelling errors I made above in my non-classical Latin.

"Metallus" should of course be "metallum", or better, its plural, although I suspect that what I really meant to write was "metallicus".

There should be only one El in "cobalus" and "cobalinus", not two, as Joshua has quietly noticed. There are also variants of these words that are spelled with Ge rather than Ce. I confess to never having read either of these words in any actual Latin text; I have only ever seen them in etymological essays on their English cognates: kobold, goblin, and cobalt.

The Latin reference to Scandinavian trolls makes its appearance in Olaus Magnus' "Historia de Gentibus Septentrionalibus", book 6, chapter 8, titled, appropriately enough, "De metallicis daemonibus". More interesting to me, at least, is finding the Latin word for elves: "Eluae" (book 3, chapter 10). Olaus's book really would be a great resource for anyone interested in doing for Tolkien what Peter Needham has done for Harrius Potter.